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1. muesli (fribbledom@mastodon.social)'s status on Tuesday, 11-Oct-2022 08:26:24 UTC muesli

   "Civilizations die from suicide, not by murder."

   -- Arnold Toynbee

   • muesli (fribbledom@mastodon.social)'s status on Tuesday, 11-Oct-2022 10:53:48 UTC muesli

     in reply to

     • Jasper

     @jasper

     Generalizations should always be treated with caution, and that's obviously no different in this case.

     It still remains a thought provoking quote, don't you agree?

     It reminds me of the Roman empire as much as it reminds me of the current affairs all over the world. The US, Europe, Russia.

   • Jasper 🍉 (jasper@mastodon.nl)'s status on Tuesday, 11-Oct-2022 10:53:50 UTC Jasper 🍉

     in reply to

     • muesli

     @fribbledom
     I guess many civilizations weren't just destroyed or absorbed(or both) by various empires, way more than they destroyed themselves. (like the Mongols, Roman empire, Alexander "the Great") But https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnold_J._Toynbee#Challenge_and_response it indicates maybe the implication of his words isn't that straightforward.

     A drought or the ground slowly getting saltier isn't necessarily something those civilizations can adapt too. They possibly had no idea.

   • Jasper 🍉 (jasper@mastodon.nl)'s status on Tuesday, 11-Oct-2022 10:53:52 UTC Jasper 🍉

     in reply to

     • muesli

     @fribbledom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnold_J._Toynbee#Political_influence_in_foreign_policy this looks really bad..

     I am sure that it's complicated and all but him talking to Hitler like that is evidence of something fundamentally wrong with his ethics..

   • manuelcaeiro ☕ (manuelcaeiro@mastodon.social)'s status on Tuesday, 11-Oct-2022 11:32:23 UTC manuelcaeiro ☕

     in reply to

     • muesli

     @fribbledom
     A.T. is absolutely right.
     I would recommend the reading of The Ruins of Palmyra, by Volney, to the previous commentators.
     It's free: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/1397/1397-h/1397-h.htm

   • vy@mastodon.social's status on Tuesday, 11-Oct-2022 12:52:45 UTC vy

     in reply to

     • muesli

     @fribbledom tedious and wrong